00:00:00: Welcome to Still Scared Talking Children's Horror, a podcast about creepy spooky and disturbing children's books films and TV.

00:00:08: I'm Rhynne Wednesday.

00:00:09: my co-host is Adam Wybray.

00:00:11: today we're joined by special guest Cat Burrows To talk about The Thief Of Always By Clive Barker.

00:00:18: A full transcript of this episode will be available so check the show notes for that.

00:00:22: Enjoy!

00:01:05: Good evening Adam And welcome to our guest.

00:01:09: cat burrows totally unsuspicious person.

00:01:15: I am doing everything legal!

00:01:17: Yeah, i mean...I have heard some things but you know..i'm fine to have Kat on the podcast.

00:01:26: Thankyou nothing has ever been proven.

00:01:28: Well that's our policy okay.

00:01:34: so

00:01:35: Let's move

00:01:36: on.

00:01:36: We're talking about the FIFA Allways today as written by Clive Barker, another non-sus individual.

00:01:45: Clive Parker of course!

00:01:48: Of The Hellraiser series.

00:01:50: yeah

00:01:53: that's thoroughly wholesome man.

00:01:55: we are not covering the hellraiser films.

00:01:58: however I'm still scared.

00:01:59: i hear there is a lot of them.

00:02:01: Kat have you actually watched quite few?

00:02:04: A number, I mean the first is just an outright good movie.

00:02:08: The second probably has some of my favourite visuals ever.

00:02:11: they get very silly which i love and then they get really bad Which you also kind-of love.

00:02:19: They've done them.

00:02:21: now it's all really really gory And im too much for Wim to actually watch any new ones.

00:02:24: Yeah...I watched the

00:02:24: first two in preparation For reading Clive Burkers Jordan books And I really enjoyed them, yeah.

00:02:38: Yeah!

00:02:39: I mean that was a surprise trend because you're not always one for sort of squishy body horror.

00:02:44: You can get the squid and... No no.

00:02:46: ...you said he would've liked him?

00:02:48: Yeah i don't know.

00:02:50: they maybe helped but..I was watching with a friend who kept talking about wet puppets and that made me laugh.

00:02:59: It's

00:03:00: good practical effects so satisfying to watch.

00:03:04: Yeah, they're really good.

00:03:06: They are really squishy and wet and glistening but It's like it's cool.

00:03:12: yeah, they ruin some good outfits in the first one.

00:03:18: So I haven't actually watched them.

00:03:21: i've listened to Some of the evolution a horror pod episodes on them so my must get around to them?

00:03:28: I also likewise own The two thousand one video game clive bark is undying which, again I've not actually ever got round to.

00:03:43: Did an FMV game as well?

00:03:49: Me and Ali have recently been playing our way through Sierra's Phantasmogoria their notorious but wildly successful FMV games that i played before.

00:04:01: so im kind of in the mood for actors having, well not having to but necessarily acting maybe in a very stilted way.

00:04:11: In front of green screen.

00:04:13: so yeah I'm... Maybe i'll be playing that soon as well?

00:04:17: Yeah

00:04:19: because I have to say..I loved this book!

00:04:21: This is incredible!

00:04:24: So is there a clubbarker known for Hellraiser and the stories based on?

00:04:30: it's also director and an artist.

00:04:34: And he also wrote and illustrated this children's horror novel, The Thief of Always published in two

00:04:42: which I don't

00:04:43: think is a widely known

00:04:45: fact!

00:04:45: Yeah who knew?

00:04:47: Well Captain did so thank you.

00:04:49: yes

00:04:52: um yeah it was.

00:04:54: me and Adam have been doing this podcast for a while and we're quite familiar with children's And I met Kat when i was visiting my sibling Willi in London and she said, oh you should do the thief of always.

00:05:09: So yeah!

00:05:11: So

00:05:13: Kat how did you discover

00:05:14: it?

00:05:15: I was trying to remember this the other day... ...and I don't know It sort appeared on my radar.

00:05:20: that way things do.

00:05:25: I had a stepdad who was really into horror.

00:05:28: The Green Mile was coming out in serial form, like these tiny little books and he got all of them.

00:05:34: so i suspect it must have come through him And actually reading it would make sense because Stephen King sort-of declared that Clive Barker is the new incredible scene or person on the horror scene.

00:05:49: There are some slight There, you can see a little bit of echoes.

00:05:54: I don't think Clive Barker was like directly inspired by it but It did come out in like nineteen eighty six and its another one of the children trying to deal with something overwhelmingly horrific and, and something that adults can't deal with.

00:06:13: And I think my love for this book because i loved it deeply really set up kind of later like finding Clive Barker's other work, Finding Stephen King uh...and really enjoying strong kids especially strong girl characters which the book has um.. and yeah kinda life reading good horror fantasy.

00:06:35: Yeah, I mean this is like what i wanted stranger things to be in instead of the aggressively disappointing action CGI fest that stretched on and on for what felt like decades.

00:06:53: But you can't replicate a language?

00:06:54: I mean Clive Barker is one of those people who think even his language will say texture that honestly, like it's you don't need to imagine anything.

00:07:10: It's going to be intrusively in your head.

00:07:13: I didn't reread this book so much as i remembered it and the words just sort of danced across my eyes to kind of prepare for this.

00:07:22: We have

00:07:23: what

00:07:26: um...I guess yeah What were your most um your strongest memories from reading it?

00:07:30: As a kid

00:07:32: Um there are phrases of the things that I think, like The Great Grey Beast February.

00:07:39: Like it did in the first sentence as you know something like Harvey Swick was eaten alive by the great grey beast february and i still think of that whole month like that!

00:07:50: And then...the moment when mrs griffin sees him goes harvey swick.

00:07:55: as i live things in here that I just, uh...I'd like have since memories of.

00:08:01: You know the blue cat with the coat as sky-blue and it the idea of like, what?

00:08:09: The beetle and the worm getting into everything.

00:08:12: Like there's just- he writes these fish hooks that just stick in your brain And you've just kind of grew up with them In their.

00:08:18: they become kind of this beautiful little piercings which is works because Clive Barker Is a progenitor of Goths.

00:08:27: He makes Goth.

00:08:28: You read him then you become more Goth Even if we're least Goth person in the

00:08:32: world.

00:08:35: Yeah That was a lovely description.

00:08:41: And we've got the same covers, Kat.

00:08:45: As ever my webcam does not work on Discord so you can't see me or my cover but that you kindly showed your book cover and it's presumably the first edition... It is a hardback!

00:09:00: ...and

00:09:01: its got The House which are Harvey is spirited away to, it's glowing and illuminated.

00:09:13: And then this sort of awful like serpentine face emerging from the foliage below the house?

00:09:22: Yes that copy has his illustrations all the way through because its one of few books that Clive Barker as a good artist as well I love his illustrations.

00:09:36: I was gushing about this book and they were very kindly listening to me, just monologue that i learned to draw by drawing the illustrations in this book.

00:09:48: Yeah

00:09:52: there are really good illustrations like their um... Just black ink pen?

00:10:01: I think some of it sort looks like brush pen so again textured but kind of scratchy and fluid at the same time.

00:10:15: Yeah, they are both compelling and grotesque which is something that I love in my artwork you know?

00:10:21: I'm a really ugly Beardsley fan um... And-and i love just good horror art!

00:10:26: You know?

00:10:27: Um..And

00:10:28: there's actually uh....I went to university during COVID and I was an Aberdeen and they've got us surprisingly good art museums here a bust that Clive Barker did, and it's sort of representation of Francis Bacon who is another fantastic horror artist.

00:10:48: And I remember finding in him being like this was the best thing on Aberdeen!

00:10:55: That's

00:11:00: really cool.

00:11:00: Yeah your cover isn't quite as

00:11:02: inspiring as it is a later edition but its very

00:11:10: blue.

00:11:11: it's got some little sparkly bits and a boy sort of walking into a bright light in his shadow, he has big sort of bat wings which is fine but not as evocative.

00:11:37: Yeah

00:11:38: I'm quite excited to bring this edition into my new school because i've got a new job!

00:11:43: And yeah definitely want to put this on the bookshelf in my classroom.

00:11:51: So yeah, as Kat said the first sentence is a real banger of an opening sentence.

00:12:03: The Great Grey Beast February had eaten Harvey Swick alive.

00:12:07: Here.

00:12:07: he was buried in the belly that smothering month wondering if you would ever find his way out through cold coils at lay between here and Easter.

00:12:22: It is, but it's also so like when he goes on and you know He kind of posits this person wondering how Harvey had died.

00:12:30: And then

00:12:31: takes us You know?

00:12:32: He'd follow through the streets.

00:12:34: He'd sit where Harvey would sit to be bored in this way Then completely understand with tears in his eyes that Harvey Zwick was eaten by The Great Grave East February.

00:12:44: as a very melodramatic only child I definitely had like that series of thoughts, so this is going to happen and they'll wonder why.

00:12:51: then totally understand.

00:12:54: And feel sorry for me!

00:12:57: They will think i was such a brave little soldier.

00:13:04: So yeah Harvey's bored.

00:13:09: the weather is horrible.

00:13:11: his mother tells him don't sit wishing their days away life too short but he is, and a strange kind of scrawny smiling figure blows through his bedroom window and offers to take Harvey somewhere out this world.

00:13:32: This character is Richter's, and Harvey kind of agrees... Richter comes back when Harvey agrees with him for Mr Hood's holiday house um which yeah.

00:13:52: so I think this the way i sort of thinking about kind of uh sort of approaching this book is kind of through sort of different children's horror tropes because it covers quite a lot of them that we've kind of identified over the course.

00:14:18: Yeah, there's one of the main ones that we kind... Well they've gotten to be first.

00:14:24: We already ticked off.

00:14:26: as soon as Harvey flies off a rictus is he has ditched his parents and you have get your parents out in order for them to go on and have their lunch at home.

00:14:40: but I guess yeah we quickly got another staple genre of the weird house, which we've encountered quite a lot in previous episodes like Paper House and Marianne Dreams.

00:15:05: It's like The Haunted Mansion, Casper Movie Monster House.

00:15:11: um uh...and not that we've done an episode on it but Coraline is kind comparison that kept coming to mind for me.

00:15:27: Yeah, I think thats fair and Rick just arriving at the window is when he's not

00:15:37: explicitly

00:15:39: referred as a vampire.

00:15:40: you know there's vampiric imagery in here.

00:15:43: later Harvey it actually transforms into a kind of vampire but its very Salem slot like before Four recording cat was the making some comparisons to Stephen King.

00:15:57: He mentioned obviously Comparisoned it This is just a few years later, but that seemed like really salient lot image to me.

00:16:08: and this character arriving at The window But It's deliberately kind of underplayed in as much as Harvey maybe because he's looking for adventure Is suspicious of Richter?

00:16:23: not scared.

00:16:24: and i was going to kind of almost object and say well he didn't invite him in but actually, he did.

00:16:28: He said if I don't have some fun ill die!

00:16:31: Ill do it, ill

00:16:31: die!".

00:16:32: And sometimes like we've learned from things like you know David Bowie's labyrinth Sometimes If You Say Something Loud Enough With An Intention It Invites Things.

00:16:42: Things Are Listening To You.

00:16:47: Oh yeah?

00:16:47: Yeah...I definitely felt that he'd drawn the Drawn Rictus for

00:16:50: The House.

00:16:51: Um..yeah so So we come, this house... This house what?

00:17:02: We quite quickly learn is animated by a sinister presence.

00:17:07: It's uh but it's kind of gingerbread house of us all in that its deceptively beguiling

00:17:23: and the grounds are described as gorgeous right!

00:17:27: We spend quite a lot time at The Garden.

00:17:30: I really like this idea of the seasons and you'll get into that later, i'm sure.

00:17:35: But the season's obviously passed very fast because it almost looks as if you've got your best of a season.

00:17:40: It is like the seasons have been distilled or condensed.

00:17:43: So you know...the most so brightened for come spring And then You know..the most dazzling relaxing summer The most crisp and eerie autumn And winter just becomes Christmas.

00:17:59: I really like the idea of, yeah.

00:18:02: The seasons being kind of condensed down to their essence.

00:18:05: Re-reading

00:18:05: it again?

00:18:05: I was surprised because even though...it becomes REALLY horrifying!

00:18:11: It really does.

00:18:12: Clav Barker is a master at this.

00:18:14: There's such beauty in the very small.

00:18:19: the pace is much faster than I remember it being.

00:18:23: But yeah, he comes in and high summer they go through a wall of kind of clinging mist from.

00:18:31: It's called, like, Milsap?

00:18:34: Like Barker is great at making these hideous place names.

00:18:37: In Aberat it's called Chicken Town.

00:18:39: He makes his places name so you're just like.

00:18:42: this is horrible.

00:18:43: You know, Lurgen or someplace that no one would ever want to be but no-one wants from.

00:18:49: But you escape and its high summer flowers in the tall grass and a boundless sky.

00:18:58: And you

00:18:59: have an open front porch, someone welcoming you in.

00:19:02: it is... It's the dream!

00:19:03: It's homecoming You know?

00:19:06: Yeah He's welcomed by Mrs Griffin.

00:19:10: he's an ancient friendly old woman who produces all of the food that and he meets the other children who are Wendell, who is kind of goofy and exuberant.

00:19:34: And Lulu has been at the house for the longest...and she's withdrawn!

00:19:45: Yeah I love that moment where he hesitates on his threshold but almost doesn't come in Because he's always shown as being like, He might be impulsive and he is a child.

00:19:56: But here it shows us having way of thinking about things.

00:20:04: that seems much older than I think he was ten or something but its windows exuberance his uncontrollable laughter uh, his is absolute joy.

00:20:15: It's the joy of the children in there because you know as we learn The House Is A House Of Illusions.

00:20:20: but for a brief moment that-the thing that's so melancholic about the book?

00:20:25: For a brief movement.

00:20:25: the joy is real like it's just.

00:20:28: it doesn't last.

00:20:34: Yeah and I'll just read the description of them.

00:20:40: um of Harvey stepping through...through the wall unless i'm stepping on anyone's texture.

00:20:48: There's so many textures.

00:20:54: There

00:20:56: are a lot

00:21:04: of textures.

00:21:06: Mine comes later, yeah... See how you go!

00:21:19: The Misty Stones seem to reach for him in their turn, wrapping their soft grey arms around his shoulders and ushering him through the wall.

00:21:32: Yeah there's just... as I was reading it was sort of putting crosses by interesting turns of phrase and textures.

00:21:40: There are a lot of crosses!

00:21:42: There is just alot of

00:21:46: interesting

00:21:46: choices.

00:21:47: Barker words real good.

00:21:52: When i really like this one it describes Wendell as having a spaghetti grin at one point.

00:22:08: Yeah, so the joy of the house is that you experience all these seasons in a day and like Adam said they're sort.

00:22:16: Yeah, autumn is Halloween and I think... There are moments of horror before we get to that.

00:22:39: Well there's the almost immediate death of one of the parents which really shocked me!

00:22:44: I forgot how soon it was?

00:22:45: Is this morning after or something like

00:22:48: that?!

00:22:48: It's very... yeah it's his arrival.

00:22:54: Was he the thing that changed?

00:22:57: Like, the ecosystem of The House?

00:23:00: because before that I think... ...the three cats had always been there as long as Mrs Griffin

00:23:07: had.

00:23:08: Yeah and it comes just after their discussion about the fish as well where Harvey and Wendell are talking about being summer and Harvey's like, Well, I saw her in a cone swim when there's like, there is but you know don't really want to go around the lake.

00:23:30: um and Harvey asked if there was any fish.

00:23:34: And oh maybe we could catch some of Mrs Griffin who cooked them for us!

00:23:39: And then Mrs Griffithers are really shocked by this because what will be learned later about the fish?

00:23:51: But yeah so that kind sort of quite the very foreboding moment is almost immediately followed by The Death of Poor Clue Cat.

00:24:05: They don't linger on it as much as they could, but yeah something like a little satin mass you're really... It does get you!

00:24:17: Yeah and so Harvey does go to the lake.

00:24:30: quite horrible.

00:24:36: He sort of sees Lulu there, standing by this sort of scummy kind-of fly ridden

00:24:44: like

00:24:45: dark and dank lake.

00:24:48: it's like what she doing that.

00:24:49: but yeah so these are.

00:24:53: you know we're getting quite strong hints about what's worth to come.

00:25:03: And he is still liberally setting up, like Harvey does realise that the lake is opposite of The House?

00:25:07: Like The House is alive and The Lake Is Dead...the house is changing..the lake is stagnant and fetid!

00:25:17: It also sets up as Harvey being a kid who asks questions right from when Rectus first comes through his window.

00:25:25: Harvey was asking too many and he just keeps asking questions, like random questions about the fish.

00:25:32: Like oh why would you have a fish like that?

00:25:34: You know everything else is so beautiful.

00:25:35: it's this horrible ugly lake And Wendell's just who cares This?

00:25:45: his response Yeah we get a cameo from Pinhead.

00:26:00: Hey yeah, I was delighted to do the

00:26:05: alarm.

00:26:06: In an illustration of Halloween masks hanging on a wall one is the pinhead mask alongside a very other creepy creatures.

00:26:25: Yeah there's a particularly evil looking punch mask.

00:26:28: That's a bad point.

00:26:38: So this is for Halloween.

00:26:40: they get to dress up and choose a mask, go out on an end... enjoy the spooky evening!

00:26:51: Wendell plays a trick.

00:26:53: I guess it gives you a chance.

00:26:56: just straight-up horror.

00:26:58: because

00:27:01: oh no yeah the horrible picture.

00:27:03: um yeah well yeah it's a horrible picture and the horrible description.

00:27:11: can i read it?

00:27:14: okay so he's outside, searching for Wendell.

00:27:22: He thinks that here is the creaking of a ladder.

00:27:28: It was not a ladder!

00:27:30: He'd heard creaking...it.

00:27:37: And in his hand the leg of man hanging from the noose.

00:27:43: He let go and stumbled backwards, barely expressing a second shout as eyes rose to meet dead men's stare.

00:27:49: To judge by expression he had died horribly.

00:27:52: His tongue lulled with his foamy lips.

00:27:55: His veins were so swollen With blood.

00:27:58: this head looked like

00:27:59: pumpkin.

00:28:02: Be for

00:28:02: that or it was a pumpkin.

00:28:07: A fresh fountain of sparks now burst from the firework and Harvey sawed the truth for the matter.

00:28:13: The limb he'd held was a stuffed trouser leg, the body a coat spilling bundles of clothes... ...the head a mask on a pumpkin with cream for spittle and eggs for

00:28:24: eyes.".

00:28:26: And in-in the picture the eggs are very kind sloppy Yoshi eggs that are dribbling down.

00:28:35: the pumpkin's won't be gone to the face.

00:28:39: I think it says something when i reread this, and just went how do you get the eggs to stay there?

00:28:48: It is a great question!

00:28:49: Yes,

00:28:49: a special egg glue.

00:28:55: Do you remember being scared by this book as a kid?

00:29:00: yes but Uh, much more compelled.

00:29:04: Like I was scared by what came later.

00:29:06: uh so i'll tell you though especially with my texture like it's all kind of wrapped up in a scene that happens later but um... But I-I was more compelled because Harvey isn't a Mary Sue.

00:29:24: he lies to his friends to entertain them.

00:29:27: He is mischievous and does play tricks cries, win.

00:29:34: A cat dies and comforts people even though he isn't half to another person.

00:29:40: shirk the responsibility.

00:29:42: So I think that for a moment he gets very villainous Coming up when he has his revenge on Wendell.

00:29:52: You feel how much joy you'd have at being suddenly gifted with power especially if you're someone helpless, like a small child.

00:30:05: But yeah I think that's why i always found him

00:30:08: and Lulu

00:30:09: such compelling characters.

00:30:17: Yeah so in terms of being gifted this power it is when we meet the second... um don't know maybe he's called them really?

00:30:27: They are called brood.

00:30:28: they refer to each other as sister or brother.

00:30:36: But I guess you'd call, yes we called them probably like underlings, henchmen, eagles.

00:30:45: Yeah!

00:30:47: So so we've met Rictus and then on this Halloween where Harvey gets his revenge... We meet Marr and Jive

00:31:02: Barker's.

00:31:03: really good for teaching you vocabulary, I find.

00:31:05: Like i reread this and was like oh man yeah!

00:31:10: And he uses...he doesn't pander..I know that it is the end of childhood early YA but just....it was great to confidently use the word quizzical after reading stuff Probably not within the normal reach, but you know he names people for their strongest attribute or at least the underlings are named by that.

00:31:39: Yeah so Jive is like twitchy and there was moving right?

00:31:43: And Richter has a huge grin...and Marr can change things!

00:31:54: The description of her.

00:31:55: it's pretty grotesque.

00:32:01: So like if you've ever

00:32:28: had a truly limp handshake from someone like i do it.

00:32:37: yeah very um a clammy, a clamy description.

00:32:42: Clammy is such a good

00:32:44: word!

00:32:44: Yeah but she has the power of transformation.

00:32:51: and for this prank here they...she transforms Harvey into Into a vampire of sorts, but with fangs like a wolf and a red throat in white skin.

00:33:15: Yeah so just his his kind of fantasy horrible horrible creature

00:33:26: But someone that could fly.

00:33:27: I mean the wings.

00:33:29: yeah

00:33:36: And he does not use his newfound powers for

00:33:38: good.

00:33:42: No He uses them to thoroughly throw it in Wendell.

00:33:55: Yeah, kind of

00:33:57: One moment I was always curious about because he doesn't take the first leap.

00:34:01: uh i think Jive pushes him off the roof just to see if he can fly and he does!

00:34:06: And there is this moment of like terrible joy where like the moon looks down on him with a face at his mother...and he saves himself and he's able to fly.

00:34:16: So, like what would have- were they just trying?

00:34:21: Like if he... because you wonder about the other children and how many times they had done this sort of thing to them before.

00:34:30: How many children had been tempted?

00:34:32: Would they've pushed him off a roof or got scooshed at the bottom?

00:34:37: then that'd be it!

00:34:39: Okay well time for another kid.

00:34:42: Yeah Yes, it seems likely.

00:34:55: Well I liked the uncertainty and in fact It's not wholly resolved.

00:34:59: how many children have been ensnared in this place?

00:35:02: And it seems to have existed maybe forever and certainly for centuries...

00:35:07: Or for always!

00:35:08: ...and yeah Yeah, I guess the thief of all ways.

00:35:12: and Yeah there they're-I don't know why too much but There is some sort of redemptive ending.

00:35:20: But You don't get the sense that every child is necessarily saved and released.

00:35:31: It's all a bit uncertain, I think.

00:35:36: So yeah... That's this sort of transformation of Harvey.

00:35:39: but there also another classic childrens horror trope of animal transformation.

00:35:50: if you think about the boys turning into donkeys in Pinocchio The protagonist turning into a mouse being turned in to our mouths and the witches I think we have another strong entry Into the children's horror canon.

00:36:13: What was that?

00:36:15: Goosebumps.

00:36:16: We've watched.

00:36:17: is it werewolf skin or something?

00:36:20: Yeah,

00:36:20: would be.

00:36:21: definitely there's every bits of goosebumps if they yeah turning into animals.

00:36:27: I mean Goosebumps loves its transformations whether it's you know via a mask or yeah turning in to a monster, turning into some kind of animal getting big and small.

00:36:37: all that's very goose bumps.

00:36:40: Should we do texture the week?

00:36:42: Yeah

00:36:43: i think we need to say it or sing it in real monster voices.

00:36:49: Cat, you don't have to.

00:36:53: It's not... We don't make guests.

00:36:55: Well thank-you I appreciate that!

00:36:56: Oh

00:36:56: well they can but yeah

00:37:10: we don't HAVE TO.

00:37:16: That was way more fun as an on-listener

00:37:19: than

00:37:19: as a participant i

00:37:22: think.

00:37:25: Would you like to go first?

00:37:26: Oh yeah, thanks.

00:37:28: It's been living in my head rent-free since I first read this book at probably slightly too young an age.

00:37:35: um it's going to spoil a little bit of the ending.

00:37:38: is that okay?

00:37:40: Yeah

00:37:41: Okay.

00:37:41: So spoilers from here.

00:37:44: Hopefully if you listen this far and are interested And don't want spoilers You're intrigued enough because its really great.

00:37:51: All three of us enthusiastically recommend

00:37:54: Thank you.

00:37:56: So when Harvey comes back to deal with the house, he at some point confronts Mar again and she reaches out.

00:38:06: change him into something humble.

00:38:10: It has kind of this line that if he realized who was happy being it but asked her what she wanted to be She had asked them.

00:38:17: his dreams were.

00:38:18: so in his turn asked her rejected the power that she had in her hand, so it sent it flowing back into her and she starts to dissolve into these big kind of gobs of like this sort of slime.

00:38:33: And she goes I dream of nothing!

00:38:36: So nothing is what i'm turning too...so its very much this dissolving slime-like just handfuls of gob's coming down.

00:38:47: Yeah.

00:38:50: Yep

00:38:51: Yeah, it reminded me of the other father in Coralite.

00:38:59: I guess maybe the idea that these beings never truly existed or have been created and that idea of the being collapsing into undifferentiated mush... Or slime?

00:39:19: It's really horrible.

00:39:29: And there is

00:39:32: a really horrible drawing to go with it?

00:39:35: Yes, there is!

00:39:36: Oh gosh yeah... That was the thing that scared me as a kid and I read his work so much of stuff compulsively afterwards, I must like being this disgusted.

00:39:53: Excellent texture!

00:39:56: Adam?

00:39:59: Yeah... So mine was just a small vivid texture when Mrs Griffin is first introduced at the doorway as I live and breathe.

00:40:19: He looked down, the Wolvervein's white silhouette still behind his eyes.

00:40:23: And there on the porch stood a woman who made its grandmother The oldest person he knew.

00:40:28: Look young.

00:40:30: She had her face in this my texture A face like a rolled up ball of cobwebs From which hair Which could also have been spider work fell In wispy abundance.

00:40:43: Her eyes were tiny Her mouth tight to hands gnarled.

00:40:46: Her voice, however was melodious and it's words welcoming.

00:40:51: Yeah I love the simile.

00:40:53: she had a face like a rolled-up ball of cobwebs.

00:40:55: Yeah yeah and spiders work as well It's not...not a common phrase!

00:41:06: Yeah Okay so i also went horrible with mine.

00:41:14: um And this is um.

00:41:19: Um I

00:41:20: don't know.

00:41:23: As soon as we met the dark foreboding pond full of fish, I was like oh no!

00:41:32: I guess you know where this is going.

00:41:37: And so it was... The fish do turn out to be children who have never left their house and Lulu becomes one of them.

00:41:59: Lulu had reached the bank and for a moment, the meagre starlight found her.

00:42:04: All that Harvey had feared was true...and more A fin grew from her bent and scaly back And her legs almost fused together.

00:42:13: Her arms have become short and stubby Her fingers webbed But it's her face glimpses.

00:42:18: she turned to look at him.

00:42:19: That is the greatest shock.

00:42:22: Her hair had fallen out and her nose disappeared.

00:42:25: Her mouth had lost its lips, And her blue eyes turned to swivelling silver balls, Lidlis & lashless!

00:42:31: Yet despite their freakishness there was human feeling in those eyes... ...and on that mouth.

00:42:36: a terrible sadness That he knew would never leave his heart.

00:42:39: if you lived To be a thousand You are my friend she said as she teeted On the bank.

00:42:44: Thank-you for that.

00:42:45: Then she tumbled into water.

00:42:49: I loved Lulu.

00:42:50: I wish we'd gotten to spend more time with her.

00:42:52: just because they at least gave her like, he showed their friendship in kind of a brief period of time.

00:43:00: He showed that she was smart enough to figure out what's happening to her long before and perhaps one of the only children who really understood.

00:43:08: And then Barker gives her kinda killing blow.

00:43:14: Like Harvey is smart or Harvey is brave but Lulu is the smart one.

00:43:18: So definitely one of the all-time good girl characters in horror books.

00:43:28: Yeah they do, she's not in it for long but they get a real friendship and there is a real connection between the two of them.

00:43:41: I think so because Wendell kind Like, we didn't mention it.

00:43:44: but when Harvey goes after Wendell, Wendel tries to get the monsters he sees that to attack Harvey instead of him by going you don't want me I'm fat go get Harvey.

00:43:54: So even though...it kind of teaches you there's like two kinds of friendship in life.

00:44:00: There are lots types of friendships But this book covers the loud boisterous fun lovely friendship and then quiet friendship.

00:44:11: You know, we'll have your back and when you think they're gone They are actually running after your nemesis with a gigantic piece of wood to hit them in the back of their knee.

00:44:19: And I think that's beautiful.

00:44:23: Yeah So so we get this.

00:44:29: um...so After seeing Lulu turn into her fish Um Harvey It's like, they need to get out of there.

00:44:45: Him and Wendell...they do escape!

00:44:54: They're set upon by Kana which is the remaining member of The Brood who was a winged-and-toothed creature.

00:45:07: Like a gargoyle kind of thing but horrible

00:45:16: They sort of, they managed to escape and get out pursued by Carter.

00:45:21: And kind of smashes itself against the wall.

00:45:28: that almost destroys it self in the process trying to catch them... ...and then they're out!

00:45:37: And then you got chapter fourteen which is called Time Was Which I found really creepy.

00:45:44: It

00:45:45: was haunting, it's absolutely haunting.

00:45:48: Yeah and I think this is a sort of another...I'm not quite sure how to describe but there's certain thing that happens in childrens horror I guess?

00:46:02: It reminded me in tone or in kind of tenor of horror when- I've talked about before probably because it terrified Moomintroll hides in the magic hat and comes out as a creature, like a weird-looking creature.

00:46:22: And his mum doesn't recognise him!

00:46:25: And I just found this so scary...and then there's some similar kind of aspect here that it turns out....I didn't see this coming actually.

00:46:40: No,

00:46:43: no I didn't actually and it makes you absolutely could see coming right.

00:46:47: It's complete sense

00:46:48: But turns out that for every day at the holiday house if ever run through the seasons a whole year has passed in the outside world.

00:46:59: Yes, so Narnia like hmm

00:47:02: So

00:47:03: or the reverse?

00:47:05: Yeah

00:47:11: He spent a month in the house, but now his parents are thirty-one years older than when he left And he knows that they've been Waiting for him and mourning him not knowing what happened to him.

00:47:30: That whole time it's Yeah really really gave me shivers.

00:47:40: Yeah, it's just the.

00:47:41: they kept his room.

00:47:42: The same way for the longest time and then she said They finally redecorated but because they wanted to reflect the taste of a man.

00:47:51: It is real heartbreak.

00:47:54: He puts some very adult heart break into this childhood story.

00:48:00: Mm-hmm yeah And he doesn't recognize.

00:48:10: And the illustration to go with it is also haunting.

00:48:15: It's his dad opening a door as an old man, kind of with this sort of note looking tired and haunted... ...and not recognising Harvey.

00:48:33: Yeah

00:48:39: There's a quote, and I won't do it justice by Terry Pratchett where he kind of talks about the way you do horror.

00:48:44: The ways when we make something horrific is that take something very ordinary.

00:48:48: You twist just a little bit And if guys ever want to...you should do the Tiffany A. King series because there are some definite horror elements in those.

00:48:59: But yeah When she's caught this sort-of dream state She thinks shes home but somthings often it's that thing of, yeah he's gone home.

00:49:09: He has done the things which should save you and hasn't.

00:49:14: Yeah!

00:49:18: And there is a similar moment in Coraline when she escapes... ...and comes

00:49:27: back only

00:49:27: to find her parents are still missing because they're trapped in this snow globe so she has to go back.

00:49:34: It was really good trove

00:49:37: really well done in the film, actually.

00:49:39: When she crawls into bed and then makes her parents out of their

00:49:42: periods.

00:49:42: Yeah!

00:49:45: So this is completely out of left field.

00:49:46: but there's also like The Silent Hill movie if you ever saw that There was a scene where they come

00:49:51: home Oh gosh yeah when it came out It has been a long time

00:49:54: Exactly But its...it IS the worst fake-out.

00:49:59: Or ummm If we saw the descent Like the UK version the fake out of coming home and then having it not be safe.

00:50:08: Yeah,

00:50:09: yeah.

00:50:12: It's really

00:50:13: powerful.

00:50:14: The TV series Channel Zero which I really like is a sort of horror anthology series from five to ten years back.

00:50:29: That does that alot very effectively so its definitely one of the most potent horror

00:50:34: tropes And I love that.

00:50:35: Wendell just shows up and it's like, this is terrible.

00:50:38: My parents got divorced and my mother's fat...

00:50:46: He's lesser poignantly affected

00:50:50: than you are!

00:50:51: You've

00:50:51: gotta have your comic relief character in horror.

00:50:56: Like he do need every once-in a

00:50:57: while.

00:51:03: So they have to venture back?

00:51:04: Yeah

00:51:05: so they go back face the big horror to get the years back.

00:51:15: I think it's interesting, they can't find a way until they've decided to fully commit and then their house allows them

00:51:45: all of the brood before Mr.

00:51:52: Hood himself.

00:51:54: Kind of like a Scott Pilgrim thing, but in different contexts?

00:51:57: Yeah yeah I was like he liked The Elite Four exactly!

00:52:06: But uh yeah he come quite upsettingly... He comes back to find Mrs Griffin locked in a coffin and abatement

00:52:14: And they killed blue cats, but I'm so glad the cat offscreen could have dealt with another on-screen

00:52:22: cat

00:52:22: death.

00:52:22: Like this thing was bad for cat deaths!

00:52:29: Yeah... I like that.

00:52:30: it establishes one control over The Brood really are merciless because obviously Rictus puts on a fake smile right and seems kind of ingratiating, sort-of friendly.

00:52:45: So there's always that temptation to think oh maybe they're not so bad you know?

00:52:49: They just doing what we have to do.

00:52:52: but yeah...they lock her in a coffin!

00:52:55: But he gets to hear her story when she comes out.

00:52:58: actually because I listened your last episode or i listen too sorry the one before it was the Roger Rabbit one There had been comment on being young and then growing older becoming a baby.

00:53:11: And this is almost the reverse because in way of, different things were horrifying to me rereading this than it was as a child.

00:53:18: but Mrs Griffin has a thing where she grew up and grew old in a matter of days.

00:53:24: so you picture her Growing Old In The Range Of What Actually Would Have Happened.

00:53:31: So Every Day Was A Year.

00:53:33: So She Maybe

00:53:34: Had

00:53:34: Just That Brief Period Like Weeks Of Youth And then she just kept getting older.

00:53:41: She did it all because she was frightened of death, and her cat had died... ...and she didn't want to die like a cat!

00:53:50: As

00:53:51: an adult now after the experience that happens when you've been alive for a good number of decades You're like oh man this is hitting me in a way It did not When I as child knew i would live forever.

00:54:06: He

00:54:16: and of Harvey allows her to cry.

00:54:21: She's never been.

00:54:23: she's ever been able to cry in all these years.

00:54:25: You wish for it?

00:54:26: She wished to never cry again, and then it became.

00:54:29: I love that all of her wishes become curses.

00:54:36: Gretchen is making making noises in the background.

00:54:38: I'm sorry we keep talking about cats dying.

00:54:41: The last one doesn't

00:54:54: Yeah, so we've heard about Ma's oozing destruction from Cat's texture.

00:55:08: And then next it is Jive who keeps making illusions and Harvey has realised everything is an illusion.

00:55:22: I think Jive sort of implodes eating his own illusion.

00:55:27: You're

00:55:27: reminded to his belly of what he was made of,

00:55:30: which is dust!

00:55:31: That's gonna be my second texture.

00:55:34: I know we don't get to like... Get a second texture for the paper.

00:55:38: Dirt and dust and ashes yeah.

00:55:45: So um

00:55:46: And that illustration is incredible as well.

00:55:48: Like if you could just love the illustrations because they are wonderful.

00:55:54: Yeah it's very good.

00:56:00: So he's making his way up to the attic as he is beating these different broods.

00:56:07: And when does he realise that Mr Hood is The House?

00:56:17: At some point, I think there isn't a separate figure of Mr Hood.

00:56:25: He Is The House much like Monster House.

00:56:38: But yeah, so Karna is in the attic who's sort of badly wounded from there coming after them on their previous escape but still being... Still using Karna to try and attack him.

00:56:58: Yeah I think-

00:57:08: And Karna seems like more could be still maybe?

00:57:13: Then then the rest of the brood Like.

00:57:16: maybe it's easier to pity Karna because Karna seems more like a creature.

00:57:22: Yeah, doesn't seem to be able to

00:57:23: talk

00:57:25: is pretty much just something that you use as a punishment.

00:57:28: Karna stole all of Mars teeth.

00:57:31: It was alluded at the beginning.

00:57:32: would your dislike did did?

00:57:34: Karna didn't put them in Karna's mouth or Did he eat the teeth?

00:57:39: Like what did he do with the teeth?

00:57:51: Yeah, so there's this sort of claustrophobic slightly wretched battle against Kana in the attic.

00:57:59: And yeah and Harvey defeats Kana through...

00:58:06: The power of friendship?

00:58:08: Yeah gentleness compassion.

00:58:12: Oh like the sponge in it lives under beneath the sink in Goosebumps!

00:58:19: I don't remember that.

00:58:22: It's the evil sponge that

00:58:23: sucks up bad feelings.

00:58:25: Oh

00:58:27: yeah, and the way they defeat it is cradling

00:58:30: them...

00:58:31: ...and lullabies!

00:58:34: That's beautiful.

00:58:38: So have you ever had a stinky bad sponge?

00:58:40: I am not touching that.

00:58:41: I will microwave which I hear is helpful for anti-bacterial but that is getting removed with tops.

00:58:48: You're not going to cradle

00:58:55: But I did kind of want to cradle Karna, like he was very good at describing this wretched animal that is being forced to perform again and it's broken.

00:59:06: And its close to death but it's been kept alive.

00:59:10: Harvey has his realization.

00:59:11: all these minions were just being kept alive Like they weren't sentient there.

00:59:18: a spark of borrowed life in will in them doesn't want to be alive anymore.

00:59:26: And

00:59:27: it's almost like Karnan knew that by accepting the kindness that Harvey offered him, It would put an end to him and does

00:59:39: it.".

00:59:54: kind of distracting.

01:00:03: but with these sort of illusions and saying you know whatever you want have puppies, have parrots.

01:00:11: All the books in the world from Aristotle to Zola was another person stuck out my head.

01:00:16: What kid doesn't wanna read Zola?

01:00:17: I mean...I kinda did after reading this But i still do this day have not.

01:00:22: so I like how we, yeah.

01:00:29: We're deeply in the bargaining stage of grief at this point for both

01:01:10: because it is Christmas every day, so he got presents and a replica of this toy wooden Noah's Ark that he'd had as little kids who were lost.

01:01:28: That was an uncanny moment for him having the item back.

01:01:33: they've been lost in.

01:01:35: So we asked for like an animate Noah's Ark where all the animals are sort of moving around and everything.

01:01:48: And then he asks for a huge meadow of flowers but every flower is different, so trying to wear out Hoods Power really We asked for like all of the food, a mountain of foods.

01:02:08: Disgusting combinations.

01:02:12: Pig's feet was definitely in there.

01:02:14: Yeah Snail fudge with pig's foot clusters

01:02:20: Growing up deep American South.

01:02:22: I still remember there'd be jars of pigs' feet and one isle And then i would always share it into fascination.

01:02:34: And then so and then hoodslaves stop messing around, okay?

01:02:38: You need to.

01:02:39: you can have one final gift.

01:02:40: enough of that.

01:02:41: You have to accept me as your master forever.

01:02:43: It's like I'll be sad.

01:02:44: What do i do?

01:02:46: And he says...I want the seasons!

01:02:48: I want all the seasons at once.

01:02:51: Um..and Hood does it but

01:03:00: Can't stop doing it.

01:03:02: Yeah, it destroys him.

01:03:12: I guess even God didn't give us all the seasons at once so it's a tall order.

01:03:18: Yeah,

01:03:18: i would have loved to have seen it though like...I think..i read that they were trying make this into something and almost wish they don't because It won't ever look like it does in my head.

01:03:30: but yeah!

01:03:31: But yeah....and I love he finds a way to sap the power of Mr.

01:03:40: Hood enough to equalize things and he's not a magical boy.

01:03:44: like the thing is, He never shown to have any power other than just I think vitality or that quality of mind that shows.

01:03:54: people say his soul burns brightly but isn't any power that can be used because it doesn't have force.

01:04:01: all he has is bravery.

01:04:06: The qualities would make someone fighter pilot, you know?

01:04:11: A little bit of foolhardiness.

01:04:13: Um a little bit rooflessness

01:04:23: I mean.

01:04:24: i think yeah it would be very difficult to adapt.

01:04:28: You'd-I probably have to do as an animation because there's so much transformation and So much of indeterminacy in things moving from one state To another which animation tends to be much better equipped for than live action.

01:04:41: If Barker animated at himself I'd Be There on a Flash like that would be glorious I don't know,

01:04:52: it's another project.

01:04:54: A fantasy project for Henry Selig?

01:04:57: Yeah!

01:04:58: I do think...I dunno if Selig is too soft.

01:05:02: maybe because there obviously generally-

01:05:08: I mean there

01:05:08: IS whimsy in this to a degree.

01:05:14: The cats are whimsical before they die

01:05:24: But yeah.

01:05:24: so you see the illustrations of quite dark and jagged

01:05:30: Yeah.

01:05:30: But we also get a good fake-out with Hood, like

01:05:34: that's... Yeah!

01:05:37: Well Richter turns up and he says well how can you exist when the power of Hood in The House has disappeared?

01:05:44: And then he is like oh I stole a bit of magic!

01:05:47: Then he has this little globe full of magic which um.. then

01:05:57: Hood carries from the grave, you know.

01:05:59: The one hand comes out of him

01:06:01: just... A hand with foot-long fingers reach up for the rubble which

01:06:06: is again weirdly.

01:06:07: I mean maybe Gaiman did just nick bits to this before

01:06:11: a lot because You start to wonder

01:06:14: right?

01:06:15: Because very similar to the

01:06:18: other

01:06:20: mother Right!

01:06:20: With the metallic hand.

01:06:22: Yeah also has cats showing kids their way.

01:06:26: I definitely think there's cross-pallination.

01:06:27: Like, like... There was between King and Barker again with... I mean, Gaiman is provably a man of his influences.

01:06:40: look at Sandman.

01:06:44: Not much that's original.

01:06:46: He's a good weaver

01:06:47: of existing

01:06:48: influences.

01:06:50: Yeah yeah!

01:06:51: That really true.

01:06:55: But yeah, so we get this remaining hand.

01:06:59: And... This hand forces Rictus to pour the globe of magic onto the ground.

01:07:12: So We've had like The man house or the houseman?

01:07:16: I don't know.

01:07:16: now we have a man made of House.

01:07:21: It's a classic Batman-man bat configuration.

01:07:28: His eyes were made of broken mirrors in his face with gouge stone, had a mane of splinters and limbs of timber.

01:07:34: he'd shattered slates for teeth and rusty screws her fingernails And a cloak of rotted drapes that scarcely hid the darkness from sight.

01:07:43: This man would give you tetanus if gave him high

01:07:49: five.

01:07:49: Yeah Maybe

01:07:53: that's all he needed to be redeemed, you know.

01:08:01: No we do a trick.

01:08:03: He'd definitely do the down below your too slow

01:08:17: Yeah.

01:08:17: and

01:08:19: Oh, and this is where Lulu saves a day.

01:08:20: This was when

01:08:21: my girl comes back.

01:08:22: Yeah so yeah Lulu gets her get to her right moment at the end

01:08:32: And it's physical It's not like usually.

01:08:35: they let the girl out tricking but no she swings a freaking floor by floor or something in the back of his

01:08:43: head

01:08:44: you know?

01:08:45: And then Harvey grabs wretched draperies covering his dark void of a heart or something and he gets stuck into the vortex.

01:08:53: that happened where the lake is.

01:08:54: So you're like, That's satisfying!

01:08:57: This is a huge existential version of The Person that goes on all fours behind the guy And then you push the guy and he falls over.

01:09:03: so... Yeah?

01:09:10: He has properly done it processing out of the lake turning back into children as they go.

01:09:21: All naked, just naked kids

01:09:23: so it's fine!

01:09:31: And then all... They're all going their separate ways and realising that they are going back in to seperate time zones or if its all worked because I think there not- theyre'e going back

01:09:55: Which means they can't be friends!

01:09:59: Or CAN die.

01:10:01: Yes,

01:10:02: it is one of those... He writes so much about ephemeral things—things that are lost and can be regained.

01:10:11: but there's a point in this book where I kind-of started tearing up.

01:10:15: It was the fact he and Wendell have very good and friendly goodbye.

01:10:19: But he holds hands with Lulu for as long as the fog lets them before they go back because I know that there's going to be too much of an age gap, you know unless the genders were reversed and he was Leonardo DiCaprio it just wasn't going to work.

01:10:36: so... Yeah.

01:10:42: So we'd get a little ending scene with Harvey being in here at the park And, um... and someone's like at on the place where-where The House was.

01:11:06: So Matt heads up to him.

01:11:08: who knows about it?

01:11:09: so he says oh you know about her didn't he?

01:11:13: Oh yes but his-he wasn't one of them.

01:11:15: He wasn't One Of Hedges Prisoners.

01:11:17: You Know what I mean.

01:11:20: It Was-it Was Lily And she doesn't come over because She-she wants Him To Remember Her Um Young.

01:11:28: But Yeah

01:11:32: Yeah, it feels once again like the end of The child part of It when they emerge

01:11:38: from.

01:11:39: you know the tunnels and And You get this feeling.

01:11:44: Like the world isn't perfect but its better.

01:11:52: and They've done something.

01:11:58: there's a surprisingly sappy ending

01:12:00: oh gosh The like, oh yeah.

01:12:09: Are you going to read it because It does give me a little bit of a cringe?

01:12:14: I did have one single solitary tear that i'm ashamed Of.

01:12:19: What do u think?

01:12:20: Should we...shall We read it or...?

01:12:22: Do it in a fatuous voice Like

01:12:26: You can... Oh

01:12:31: no!

01:12:33: Adam do you want To- Do you Want to Read it In A Voice That You Feel Suitable?

01:12:38: The last paragraph

01:12:40: Yeah

01:12:41: Well I mean its.

01:12:42: I said it's Dickensian in places, this book.

01:12:45: It really does sound like... Right out of a Christmas carol!

01:12:52: The days that followed were unlike any Harvey had ever known though there was no more talk of hood or the house all the green hill upon which it once stood.

01:13:07: But they were all three agreed on one thing, that it was fine to be together again.

01:13:20: Time would be precious from now-on.

01:13:23: It would tick by of course as I always had but Harvey Was determined.

01:13:29: he wouldn't waste it with sighs and complaints.

01:13:32: He'd fill every moment With the seasons he found in his heart Hopes like birds On a spring branch Happiness Like warm summer sun Magic Like the rising mists of autumn and best of all love, Love enough for a thousand Christmases.

01:13:57: God bless us!

01:13:58: And God Bless Us!

01:14:00: Each and

01:14:00: every one!

01:14:02: Yeah

01:14:06: it's pyramid Christmas Carol.

01:14:10: I just see the bunny at the end.

01:14:14: It's a great book for all that.

01:14:15: I just feel like it could have taken maybe one more pass.

01:14:24: But yeah, i really enjoyed it.

01:14:27: and um And I-I really think it belongs in the up there In The Canon of Children's Horror.

01:14:37: Um uh...and Yeah you know with Coraline being Tainted by your game and being a scumbag.

01:14:49: Yeah,

01:14:50: well we've still sort of got the film.

01:14:53: We're still at least got Selik his team's animation craft.

01:14:58: yeah

01:14:59: And it is especially hard for four people of alternative and goth kind of vibes.

01:15:03: so need everyone who can get.

01:15:04: So we have Clive Barker and Trent Reznor people that are keeping the lights on.

01:15:17: I mean, the dark green light but yes!

01:15:24: Yeah um yeah.

01:15:24: thank you so much Kat for suggesting this and for coming all the parts and sharing your insights and thoughts of memories out of this book.

01:15:34: it's been really lovely.

01:15:36: Thank you for giving me a reason to reread.

01:15:39: glorious.

01:15:40: And if I can say anything, If you liked this and like his writing read a magicka it's my favorite fantasy epic.

01:15:50: It is further up than Lord of the Rings for me and i rarely ever find anyone else who has read it.

01:15:56: He is...I'm glad that he created like Hellraiser but more people need to read it

01:16:13: onto the credits, unless anyone has anything else to add.

01:16:22: No no I mean do you remember that amazing pumpkin head Halloween scare?

01:16:30: Do you remember when we tried to decorate a... was it like a wooden beam or something at your parents?

01:16:41: so he'd try and make us scary halloween tricks to scare children.

01:16:47: We had

01:16:49: a

01:16:49: horrid bear mask or something.

01:16:52: And then we have a cast

01:16:53: of my teeth and your teeth, someone's

01:16:56: teeth.

01:16:58: Yeah with the bear mask.

01:17:04: yeah I'd like stood out at door trying to scare children With it.

01:17:17: I think you might dressed in a boiler suit thing.

01:17:20: Did you have a boy in the suit?

01:17:22: One of us probably had a boy, so yeah!

01:17:25: Or maybe it was a ski... I don't know, ski suit or anything like

01:17:30: that.

01:17:30: Cool um thanks for listening.

01:17:34: um uh You can email us at stillskeadpodcast at gmail.com.

01:17:41: Have

01:17:42: he checked your emails?

01:17:45: No

01:17:45: i haven't checked their e-mails.

01:17:49: Check the emails.

01:17:50: You

01:17:51: might have some

01:17:52: emails, I've got a password for e-mails!

01:17:53: They're

01:17:59: very good at this.

01:18:01: Yeah you can follow us on Instagram.

01:18:03: it's still scaredpodcast where i do a collage For each episode and I will do a college from this episode.

01:18:13: Our intro music by Mackie Amazaki.

01:18:16: our outro musics by Joe Kelly.

01:18:17: artworks by Letty Wilson.

01:18:21: Do you have a sign off for us, I don't know.

01:18:25: Oh yeah well rated reviewers if you want to give us good reviews then we'll get more listeners.

01:18:31: apparently that's how it works.

01:18:33: and Don't Get Up To Any Egg Tricks.

01:18:36: Creepy Kids

01:18:38: Leave your egg blue at home.

01:18:46: Thanks spooky kids see ya next time.

01:18:49: thank you cat

01:18:50: again thanks Bye.